Goonfleet vs. Band of Brothers - The End is Nigh

Last night Minor Threat demonstrated that they are indeed just in Delve for the mayhem and are not taking a side in the conflict...by jumping a KenZoku Cruiser group near Period Basis. Other than a few smaller squads acting independantly in light ships, KenZoku is still inactive, still camped into PR-8CA, and still losing ground every hour.

To keep themselves from going stir crazy and boost morale, GoonSwarm members have begun to read slash fan-fiction over the Coalition teamspeak during Dreadnought seiges. Said homoerotic stories apparently involve player-characters from the game and power tools. The Northern members of the Coalition are reconsidering their political relations and reviewing their communications options.

Even though things are going their way, GoonSwarm and company are not being triumphalist or losing focus. A meme they keep quoting in their posts is "2/21". They know that if KenZoku tries anything at all, it needs to be on Saturday. They are racing to accomplish as much as possible while they are still relatively assured of a free hand.

Quoth The Mittani:...

tldr version:

j-l hellpurge will flip it tomorrow

y5c, 5-6 and 7utb are all safely in pl hands though y5c will need a hellpurge soon with 23 finfleet towers to 35 PL

BNC const is under assault, PS-94 fell today, 1 hostile tower on 10 moons left, 39P was sieged and it and 8RQ both have been spammed

EVOL's const is entirely secure with 5BTK and MO-G hellpurged, TCf has superiority in 8WA and will flip it, Y-O has 21H to 15 F RZR towers but all 21 are in RF and will die tomorrow

RKK's constellation W-4 is all done, though many hostile towers under the 51% mark remain for cleanup, thanks for the six stations kakashi-sempai~~~

DICE is busy taking down towers and evaccing their const in Period Basis. You're next.

NOL is hellpurged, C6Y and C3N are ours, and T-M is being spammed by ZAF and had hostile towers RF'd today.

and that's your delve weather update

kenny capfleet status: still trapped in PR- rololol~

The above information can be quoted because...the regular Goon Fleet forums have crashed and GoonSwarm brazenly moved their "war room" communications and operations-updates to the official EVE forums. Even if they've got the information minute to minute on where and what the Goons are up to, there's nothing KenZoku can do about it. It seems the other residents can do nothing about hundreds of Goons suddenly posting in multiple threads either; no one else is even trying to break into the spam.

This is a truncated update-post (not that there's much more to talk about) but I'm afraid it is likely to be the last regular update for some time. As of today I have another committment for my time and writing abilities (such as they are). I'll likely peek in on the situation tomorrow to see if KenZoku tries anything, but won't be able to follow it closely.

I've done the majority of the reportage up to this point, but that doesn't at all mean the thread has to stop. It's an open forum and anyone can speak up with what they know. In fact I'd be pleased if they would. If you want to follow it along on your own: The official EVE forums contain the psychological attacks and reactions to events from the participants. Scrapheap Challenge has better information about what actually took place in the various battles. The Goon Fleet, Band of Brothers, Pandemic Legion, and other killboards will let you see who downed what and how battles turned out for each side (PL's is the easiest to read). And of course, there's the daily-updated Influence Map.

Thank you to everyone who gave compliments to my posts in this thread.

Goonfleet vs. Band of Brothers

For more than five days now, KenZoku and its subordinate Alliances have remained camped into the NPC station of PR-8CA. The only activity from the blockaded parties is a few individuals trying to leave in disposable frigates or shuttles. A greater threat is currently posed by...well...Minor Threat, who now seem to be intendant upon more than quick vengeance for last weekend's moment of comedy.

In the last three days a majority of the in-system kills by GoonSwarm are Minor Threat fast Frigate and assault Cruiser gangs roving Delve. The next night, more of them are back; seeking stragglers and targets of opportunity. Given their chosen enemy's indolence, I don't think GoonSwarm minds the distraction deep down. In different circumstances, an invasion of annoyances like this could be chased out with a few flottilas of Goon assault craft and sniping Battleships. However, the focus of attention remains the systematic destruction of KenZoku's hundreds of Towers and the claiming of their territory.

Again, keep in mind that the map represents the reality on the ground from a week ago. It takes seven days for a Tower majority to officially claim Sovereignty in a system. Regardless of the delay, KenZoku Sovereignty continues to disappear because all Towers in some systems have been destroyed. KenZoku enjoyed a 42-to-8 Station majority in J-LPX7 (the site of the heaviest fighting) this morning. Each station literally has millions of hit points. By tomorrow morning, GoonSwarm and its Coalition partners expect to have razed all of them; leaving them with 0-to-8 control of a system having 108 moons. The Dreadnought teams are working around the clock with what is now a practiced, machine-like efficiency.

Meanwhile, lesser strategic threats are also being dealt with. When the BoB Sovereignty collapsed, one of the groups unaffected was the Pet Alliance Axiom Empire. Axiom Empire held Sovereignty level 3 in a couple of scattered systems. They tried to help with the resistance by emplacing new Towers of their own early in the conflict as well. Now, Axiom Empire holds no Sovereignty anywhere in Delve; thus removing one more bolt-hole for GoonSwarm's enemy to base from.

Further East, the Skunk-Works Alliance also held Sovereignty 3 in a small portion of Querious and expanded that territory early in the War to stem the tide of Goon-Coalition Tower-spam. The RAZOR Alliance, along with other members of the Northern Coalition, has done yeoman's work in attacking this redoubt. Two more Skunk-Works held systems lost all Sovereignty this morning. While Skunk-Works is putting up as little resistance as the rest of the KenZoku Pets at the moment, it must be mentioned that RAZOR and company are having to do this the old-fashioned, brute-force way. Any system with functioning Cyno-jammers means rapid reinforcement and Capital Ship firepower will not be forth-coming.

Moving away from the major combat (if I may be permitted to call it that ) zone, Against ALL Authorities and its Southern allies continue their occupation of old Goon-space and are even moving on Goon allies. Prior to the dissolution of BoB, AAA (with BoB support) had been contesting GoonSwarm territory in Tenerifis and Feythabolis. Also in the South, Stain Empire, Systematic-Chaos, C0VEN, and Atlas Alliance were fighting for Esoteria against GoonSwarm and the United Legion (UNL). UNL was able to hold its own, and backed by GoonSwarm were denying the enemy territorial gains.

When GoonSwarm relinquished their holdings in the South, UNL moved rapidly to take possession of their Feythabolis and Tenerifis domains. They have had some success in Tenerifis, contested against AAA, but have been pushed back by Red.Overlords and AAA in Feythabolis. Loss of this area means their holdings in the Southwest are cut off from South-central. Furthermore, they were not able to claim the Goons' part of Esoteria and are now beginning to lose ground in Paragon Soul.

United Legion is very much a "rear guard" for the Delve invasion, with all the risks that come with that role. So long as Stain, C0VEN, & cetera do not take Paragon Soul, there is no escape route from the southern region of the war-zone through Period Basis. KenZoku and Pet posters have made much of GoonSwarm and the Northern Coalition "abandoning" United Legion. The Goons have replied that everyone in the War Coalition knows what is at stake, what must be prioritized at the moment, and that unlike BoB/KenZoku, they do not abandon their allies or treat them as servants. UNL for its part, has expressed confidence that they can hold against their bitter rivals.

So is that all AAA is up to? In an earlier post this morning, I pointed out that a Red.Overlord ship with a Cyno-field Generator had been destroyed in PR-8CA. That could have signaled the beginning of an invasion, but there has been no other activity through (and now beyond) Russian prime-time. It's entirely possible it was simply a head-game. A cheap (literally) joke at everyone's expense.

If the Kestral had been part of a larger invasion plan, I'm afraid I would have had to revise my estimate of their stance a third time. I'd previously expressed puzzlement over why AAA would not be fully backing KenZoku when they would become the natural next target for all the parties involved. I changed my mind after I recalled that AAA is Russian; with the educational point of view on history which that implies. If you look at Against ALL Authorities territory (Catch, Tenerifis, Impass, Omist, and Feythabolis) their constellations tend to be arranged in long strings. Most of these are heavily built-up Sovereignty level 3 systems. It may be the AAA leadership's belief that, even if they end up facing a large Coaltion, they have plenty of ground to force an enemy to fight for. Their territory is very "deep", and has recently gotten deeper. If facing more enemies than they can manage, they can make a fighting retreat of it while their central territories are untouched. AAA might survive this way for a long time.

Furthermore, if they sit and wait for KenZoku and the Pets to collapse, they can pick and choose amongst their best pilots to recruit. What other alliance could they join? Where else are they going to go?

I don't think the Russians are coming to help ...

So where does that leave KenZoku and the Pets? I'm reminded of a frustrated fan sitting near me at a hockey game who screamed to his team "Do Something! Even if it's wrong!" The current KenZoku strategy is like the occupants of a besieged castle saying "forget the food stocks, I'm sure they'll pack up and leave soon enough". The longer they sit inactive, the less a breakout is likely to accomplish.

KenZoku still has possession of 26 known Titans. A group of them could break the fleet out of PR-8CA in a few minutes. They would naturally be beset immediately...unless of course another Titan could also be used as a distraction. If one was spotted trying to hop north to the borders, the bored attackers would likely swarm it from all locations. Even more-so if it turned out to be Shrike in a fifth Avatar. (The deliberate sacrifice of himself to fool his enemies would also go some ways towards recovering face for him.)

Once a breakout was made, they could either stand and fight in a single throw of the dice or retreat Northeast. If they made a stand in PR-8CA with all of the Coalition members jumping in-system, they would be attempting to cripple GoonSwarm's numbers in their space with superior firepower and bring a halt to the Tower offensive. If they retreated to Skunk-Works space, they regain Sovereignty advantages for their base while being able to range freely across the rest of Querious.

As it is, a few KenZoku members are retreating to Period Basis. Why this is a good idea is beyond me. In the Northeast, resupply from Empire should be easy. Period Basis is a cul de sac. Resupply is extremely difficult and even if they had a route through Paragon Soul, the distance is too far for a Cyno-Jump; retreating that way would mean leaving their Capital Ships and Titans behind. The Executive Outcomes Alliance, in Sovereignty 3 control of the southern half of Period Basis, has openly told their members to get their equipment out to Empire-space while they still have time.

If anything happens, it needs to happen Friday or Saturday at the latest. Anything later means there will be fewer people with time to log on for extended periods and less likelihood of building any momentum. Failing to make a move by the end of Saturday in Europe will mean the loss of many corporation members as they are faced with probability of another week of inactivity while the leadership "waits". Throwing taunts at the Goons and promising to do it a second time tomorrow is not rewarding play. (Though there have been reports that a few of *the Goons* have been stunned into silence by the vehemence and personal nature of some of the smack-talk emanating from PR-8CA.)

If KenZoku is planning to rise phoenix-like from NPC space in a few weeks, they will be sorely disappointed. Even if the Northern Coalition has gone home by that point, they have stated they are leaving a battle-fleet and Jump Clones behind in an EVE equivalent of pre-positioning. If KenZoku should reappear weeks later with any kind of strength, the North could respond within hours. Furthermore, who will wish to come with them in these forays of vengeance with little likelihood of material gain? It's conceivable that Sir Molle could form new Alliances and sortie from Delve NPC-space for years; but each time he did it would be with fewer pilots and more derision. Meanwhile, the Goons will gain all the terrain advantages that their enemy once held and more. They will have "Fortress Delve" with easy access to Empire, allied groups holding their Northern and Southeastern approaches, and the Sovereignty Level 4 constellations that once belonged to BoB.

If KenZoku fails to fight any further for what they are losing, I firmly lay the blame on a Failure of Leadership. BoB was the strongest and most feared organization in EVE. Their stated opinion was once enough to sway other Alliances. It was Sir Molle who set BoB's goal of the destruction of GoonSwarm, citing them as too rude and uncivilized to remain in Band of Brothers' Game. It was Sir Molle who declared that GoonSwarm would never be allowed to hold territory in Player Controlled Space. Where now is this majestic heater repairman while his empire burns?

When BoB first came to destroy GoonSwarm they were a new, tiny alliance based in Cloud Ring. GoonSwarm didn't have the skills or resources to fight back against the Battleships BoB was fielding against them. For two and a half weeks they sustained losses against them. Then in a shift of tactics, they made dozens of new characters named "VCBee XXX", where XXX was a random number. These throw-away characters were used for guerilla warfare against BoB. Having them destroyed essentially cost GoonSwarm nothing and any losses for Band of Brothers gained them nothing. Furthermore the unique "Goon" mentality meant they could keep up the effort indefinitely while still enjoying themselves. BoB declared GoonSwarm "Destroyed" and left the North.

If Sir Molle is indeed planning to attempt harassment of GoonSwarm from NPC space at some later date, he is willingly adopting the position GoonSwarm held when he personally declared his enemies "Destroyed" so many years ago . Take that as your Daily Irony...

Goonfleet vs. Band of Brothers

Why is the Goon side winning? In the words of Shadoo, Pandemic Legion Fleet Commander for the offensive (note: HAC = Heavy Assault Cruiser, a gunboat that can be fitted as a sniper and a favorite of Pandemic Legion)...

We have been successful this time (my 3rd time in Delve, 2nd proper offensive) -- NOT because we brought everything and the kitchen sink. We have been successful because we brought GF/KIA + MM/RZR + TCF + PL/SOT who have been operating pretty much as 4 entities with their own fleets and designated targets.

We've syncronized our sieges, had topes to cover each others and in fights -- called 3-4 different primaries across fleets on their own comms after having landed on field within a minute of each others.

Everyone's used a combined jabber, all FCs are always constantly polling for intel and how each others are doing and when they've started siege cycles. The communication and coordination over the past 2 weeks has been unparallel to anything I've seen/done before.

Delve mk1 we tried to do something like this, but it failed miserably. Nync did his own thing, Suas tried to coordinate with MC over MSN, RZR was in Querious, etc etc etc... Delve mk1 coalition assault reminds me more of GKC defence mk2 this time around infact.

You appear to be very badly coordinated, your allies on paper should outnumber/match us (and did for the first 2 days). Your issue was that your 2-3 different fleets (GKC, EXE, RKZ) in the first 3-4 days were warping in sometimes 5min after the fight kicked off and 2 min after one of you warped out. By the time you pulled everything to a single teamspeak -- your dicipline and fleet ability had dropped significantly due to heavy losses I presume.

You strategy seems to have been the old "pile up, lock system and hold it" in the W-4 const. You demonstrated very little manuverability and very little aggression to try to intercept any of the smaller groups/tower spam in the starting days of the conflict. And by the time you demonstrated aggression (Waagaa's fleet) -- I dare say it was too little too late.

When you swapped to combined fleets and shared your tower passwords for titan bridges -- you chose the Delve mk1 strategy of "pile everything to PR and base from there". I'm not sure if you expected Delve mk1 like 20 man PL HAC gangs to harass you in PR, but whoever made that decision completely failed to realize the field and spread of your hostiles.

The first time the combined fleet ended in PR -- was the last time so far it has undocked in there. It's not an issue as such for many, since you can JC and roam... But to do anything beoynd light roaming seems to have utterly stopped due to this, thus giving us keys to roam your kingdom with capitals 23/7 at speed I've not ever seen before.

I'm sorry to waffle on here, it just seems appropriate to respond to your points in your post that to me seem a little unrealistic. This whole "everyone is picking on us, so just sit and wait" line demonstrates the complete denial of what has happened and shows the usual hubris to acknowledge and try to address the issues that actually have lead you here.

Just look at the KB, view involved parties, check dotlan maps for pilot numbers and you realize -- you aren't outnumbered. Check the first 2 engagement involved pilot numbers if you want to argue "numbers on paper aren't on the battlefield".

"Hubris" is the Classical Greek concept of supercilious pride and arrogance; the unspoken belief that one can get away with anything because you cannot be harmed. Actions of Hubris end up shaming their victims and often their perpetrators. Hubris inevitably draws down the attention of Nemesis, the Greek goddess of retribution.

BoB was very much an empire. The Pet Alliances were subordinate and treated as such. They were not permitted free access to BoB's space, only what they paid rent for. They were not brought in to decision making for the BoB Alliance, or allowed to listen in; communication was through the Greater BoB Coalition (GBC) channels. If a Pet member showed up for a fleet action with "Tech 1" equipment as opposed to the more expensive "Tech 2" fittings, they were criticised by BoB's officers.

From the point of view of LuciasTrask, a Pet Alliance member (note: JC = Jump Clone, having your character appear in another pre-selected location and leaving all the ships/equipment you were using behind)....

I have been in both Delve wars, mostly on the side of BoB and then with VV for a little while, which sucked. But I can say this.

The first time around, when I was with Aftermath, we used BOB TS, we had direct orders and while the people that flew [censored] fit ships (me.. I was a noob) got scolded it still felt like one team.

This time around is different for me.

I am just an EXE nubbin right now, but when in the US TZ, we are not allowed on BOB TS so we have no idea what is going on. Im in fleets with people I dont know or have ever heard of before on the GBC TS.

I have lost 2 Falcons with only 1 rapier kill in curse to show for my efforts as the GBC leadership is alway behind the ball because of communications.

I hear "Support warp to so and so" Suddenly Im in a bubble.. then a pod, then a station. Nothing but reds in sight for the mos part. So my efforts are definitely hampered when by the time we are ordered to warp and engae, BOB has left the field and We warp onto an enemy that has already loaded grid. In some of these fights if the fleets had been unified we would have outnumbered the PL/SOT/GF/NC fleets. But we never actually seem to merge, just get suicided onto already loaded reds.

I have JC'd out of PR- leaving quite a few HAC/HIC and logistic ships behind. Whatever I will buy new ones. So thats not a big blow to me. I have plenty of BS in PB to throw at the war effort.

What does hurt the efforts in my opinion is a lack of communication between the GBC and BoB from a grunt perspective. I know basically nothing aout what is going on. I learn more from Sahdoos battle reports than when I am logged in. Kinda silly.

I have heard all the "BoB thinks you suck" talk and while it doesnt bother me if it is or isnt true I know some people it does bother. I think that is another problem.

The true solution to this problem is for everyone in the GBC to swallow their pride and shut up. Start working together, begin to fight with capitals on the field, and not be afraid to die. I mean [censored] I was in a meat shield alliance the first time around and died ALL THE TIME.

Its just pixels. Lets lose them in fun ways. The PR- camp can be broken by everyone stuck in there logging in and a quad doomsday on the station folowed by a mass undock. Then begin to drop the capitals in. Sure we may lose some, we may lose alot. We may lose a titan. But we wont to a conventional fleet, it will take a capital fleet to bring down that many caps and sub caps.

this war isnt over, it just needs to be rethought from our side.

Maybe I might get blasted for posting this, hell I dont even know if any of this is already planned. Like I said. Being a grunt on the bottom doesnt lend itself to knowing really anything of what is going on.

BoB/KenZoku has fallen to Hubris.

And the Goons are Nemesis...